Political Crossfire Forums

So after witnessing Crimea and watching the slow moving train wreck that is Ukraine I'm left wondering what's left for Putin to do and what his end game is. A part of me is starting to wonder if this isn't all a net gain in his eyes. Putin has a semi crazy/unstable infatuation with the USSR of the past. He wants to bring it back. He thinks the fall of the USSR was the greatest tragedy in the history of the world. So...

Vilifying the West as he has been, suffering under sanctions as the country now is, and now retaliating with more sanctions itself while benefitting from a current spurt of overwhelming support as the state run media praises his actions looks a little too coincidental at this point. Is he trying to stoke the old flames of the USSR and move back to being independent as possible? Trying to ignite state driven manufacturing to rev up his economy as well as his ability to centralize and control it? What's his end game here? How does this benefit him?

We can look at the Chinese angle for a second. They just signed a huge LNG deal that frankly benefits the Chinese more than it does the Russians (Price wasn't disclosed indicating that it might not have been in line with what the Europeans pay the Russians but that's ok, Putin needed something to show some strength against the West and China loves itself some more resources). China and Russia and a bit friendlier when it comes to military sales as well. But China gains nothing by engaging in military action at the moment. Not to mention that it's current actions of aggression are pushing several Pacific nations as well as economic pacts to auger against Chinese expansion. The one thing I see Russia as in a situation that involves China...is as a puppet. Russia serves as a distraction to the Europeans and the US, gets the Europeans to remain divisive due to economic circumstances and a lack of a real recovery as sanctions take their bite, and it takes attention away from the Pacific ocean as much as it can (How much of a f**k do the Europeans really give about the Pacific anyways?). So there's that.

But I see Putin trying to bring back the USSR via utilizing our responses to his actions in Eastern Europe. It all makes sense. Plus, with the backstop of the Russian economy coming unhinged (Oil is no longer shooting up in perpetuity which is a large problem for economic expansion in Russia due to a lot of exploration the world over and improved extraction methods - sup US fracking) Russia has little options in the short term. It's economy is going to suffer regardless what it does on the global scene due to a largely bureaucratic and corrupt government as well as economy. It's inefficient as f**k. Ring any bells?

Thoughts?

that chinese-russian energy pact is all show. it'll take almost five years for russia to get the infrastructure built to even take advantage of it.

and if turning russia into an isolated pariah state is his end game, let him. russia's position is to f**k weak compared to the USSRs that it would actually be laughable for them to do that.

Well this is a big step to bringing back the old USSR, there will again be empty food stores just like the old days..

I'm more creeped out by our reaction. Last week NPR had on a NYC based "russian" reporter and our former ambassador to Russia calling essentially for regime change.

The Ukrainians in the East and the Ukrainians in the West have a history of animosity, they backed different sides during WW2 (which didn't really end in the Ukraine until the mid-50s). I can see the Russians being concerned about the Eastern Ukrainians under the new...em, more western....regime.

any-who I think there is a viable narrative in which we are the meta aggressor here.

We made mistakes.. Pushing NATO further east was probably a mistake..

But lets not make Putin to be totally innocent here.. He believes the USSR collapsing was one of the worse things in history, and he wants to bring it back.. The USSR was evil.. And there's a reason why so many of the Eastern European countries went running to the West, it's because they don't trust Russia.. And with good reason, BTW..

I understand the backyard argument, but the difference is we never invaded Canada or Mexico, or even threatened to so the level of trust because us, and our 'neighbor's and between Russia and her neighbors is completely different.

Again I don't think NATO moving east was a good idea, but Russia/USSR has invaded her neighbors so many times that most couldn't wait to get into the Western sphere of influence, both militarily and economically.. So should we turn our back on them simply because they are in Russia's backyard?

the idea that putin wants to return to soviet union is rubbish put forward by boy-genius, fox news correspondent, and US diplomat extraordinaire John Bolton

so I'd take that with a grain of salt.

these are the same idiots who got us involved in Iraq